I’m Confused - Small Mesh System Design (Affordable)
This thread has been locked for further replies. You can start a new thread to share your ideas or ask questions.I’m Confused - Small Mesh System Design (Affordable)
This thread has been locked for further replies. You can start a new thread to share your ideas or ask questions.
I am trying to spec a small mesh network using TP-Link hardware, whose requirements are a little different than the prepackaged ones (and I need to keep it reasonably priced). First let me say that I want the system to have the latest technology - WIFI 6, etc. It will be located in a rural area. The house is not overly large and is currently covered with a mediocre, older router; so probably only requires one mesh unit. But I need a second mesh unit outdoors. We spend a lot of time outside there and we have several WIFI cameras outside that need a strong network connection. I would probably mount it under the roof overhang of a detached garage and use an AC power source for it. Because the signal would have to pass through a number of walls and running Ethernet cable would be difficult, my thinking is to use an “Outdoor Deco Power Line” mesh unit. Is there one? So my system would be a two-pack but one of the mesh units would be an indoor model with “Power Line” and the other one an outdoor model with “Power Line”. I am pretty sure that TP-Link marketing does not offer that package. However they do offer a lot of models which quickly confuse me. So can anyone help me specify such a system using what they do offer, including keeping the cost reasonable? Thanks.
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Hey @Bearcatboy,
I am more than happy to help clarify what's available the best I can.
Currently, there are:
- 2 Powerline Deco Models are available, and both are for indoor use (P9, PX50)
- Only 1 Outdoor Deco is available, which is powered by either AC or can be powered via PoE (Deco X50 - Outdoor)
- 2 PoE Compatible Models are Available (Deco X50 - Outdoor and Deco X50 - PoE[indoor])
On your point of using a powerline setup, an important thing to consider is that Powerline adapters need to be on the same circuit. I would imagine that your detached garage will not be on the same circuit. If you are looking at a powerline, you would probably need to look at using powerline adapters to add an Access Point or link your Decos backhaul- but your mileage would vary greatly and is dependent on many more factors than usual.
Honestly, your best option is to run ethernet cables if at all possible. Cables can be rated for outdoor and burial use, so you may be able to find ways to run ethernet cables other than through multiple walls. With PoE functionality on the X50-Outdoor you could also install the Deco wherever needed since data and power can pass over the same ethernet cable.
For what Deco offers and basing this on a wireless or ethernet backhaul, I would recommend the X50-Outdoor, along with either one or two regular mesh nodes, ideally tri-band for the performance - but any Wi-Fi 6 or 6E Mesh Node will be more than capable for most uses.
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@Bearcatboy You should do more researches about the powerline option but per many reviews it does not perform well compared to other types. It's best to extend Ethernet to garage (can you look at buried conduit with proper insulation), or by any change your garage has coax wiring? If yes, get a pair of Moca adapter and extend Ethernet to your garage with an x50 Outdoor node. I did that and the Outdoor node covers my whole back yard as well will almost 500mbps up/down.
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So , the first two replies advise against using the “Powerline” feature. It sounds like good advice. There is one way that would make the installation of Ethernet Cable fairly easy for me but I believe that it is one of the big No-No’s for running Ethernet Cable. That would be to feed the CAT5/6 through the same conduit that carries the AC wiring to the garage from the breaker panel in the basement of the house. If anyone knows of a way to do that effectively (and do no harm), I think PoE would be fairly easy to pull off. Running new cable underground, by it self, or in its’ own conduit, is of course possible - it’s just a lot of work and expense that I was hoping to avoid.
Thanks for helping me to begin to sort out the TP-Link product line. It's too bad their marketing people can't do that better.
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@Bearcatboy Powerline adapters do not need to be on the same circuit, they need to be on the same breaker panel or on the same meter.
Otherwise it would never be possible to use Powerline.
What is the distance between your garage and the house?
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I agree that the Powerline feature would be pretty useless if devises had to be on the same circuit (breaker). I think it is possible that they have to be on the same phase of the circuit panel or something needs to be added between phases if they are not. Normally, the only thing in common between phases in the panel are Neutral and Earth Ground.
That said, I do value the experience that users have had with that feature. Are there any success stories out there?
And one more complication, apparently the Deco X50 - Outdoor does not have the Powerline feature so I would have to use an Adapter. That would be an additional cost and possibly additional "issues".
Concerning distance:
- house (panel) to garage - about 30 ft.
- across garage to Mesh - about 30 ft.
- across house - Mesh to panel - about 20 ft.
- extra because wiring ain't straight - about 10 ft.
- TOTAL WIRE - about 90 - 100 ft?
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Powerline Networks, can technically cross circuits on your breaker, but it will suffer much much more than if it doesn't for a few reasons, and all the speeds that we list all have a footnote disclaiming that they should be used on the same circuit due to how much it can affect the performance.
Many breakers now include noise filters that will eliminate the powerline connection and prevent it from crossing circuits on the breaker.
Secondly, the round-trip time due to the distance required when traveling back and forth from the breaker will not only increase latency but also increase the potential for interference on the line.
Lastly, I believe that Deco Powerline Networks and Powerline Networks from an Adapter are not compatible with each other so you would need to use the Powerline adapters 'in addition' to your Decos.
I will see if I can find some time to locate the success stories on the Powerline and deco forums, but I recommend taking a look around yourself - as there are a few users who have managed similar setups to what you are looking for - with the X50 outdoor and detached garages
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WOW! The info you are feeding me is so valuable. Thank you. Things like incompatibilities between system components - in today’s world those are often painfully learned through the school of hard knocks. And breakers that have noise filtering built in - I was not aware of that feature and I do see where that could sure mess with data transmission. By the way, the garage is a circuit by itself and it might not be that difficult to move the wiring of the Main Deco AC outlet to that circuit - I will have to trace some wiring to check. I don’t think it would overload the garage circuit.
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Indeed, you would need to have two Powerline Deco, one in the house, one in the garage.
Be aware that P9 and PX50 are not compatible from a Powerline perspective, they will not communicate via the power lines.
If the indoor Deco in the garage does not provide sufficient outdoor coverage, you would indeed need an additional appliance for that.
I am not convinced that a mesh is the most cost effective solution in your case. Do you actually require transparent roaming, which is the strong point of a mesh?
I suggest considering a good wifi appliance for your house, two affordable powerline appliances and an outdoor wifi access point.
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OK, so here’s the direction I am heading and some questions about implementing my plan:
First, averaging all the connection discussion together, I think I need to bite-the-bullet and run Ethernet cable to the garage and take advantage of POE and uncompromising data transfer to and from the Outside Node that the cable offers. The only model that meets this solution is Deco X50 - Outdoor. Current Amazon price $130.
For my Indoor, main Deco, I think either Deco X50-POE-Indoor (2 gigabit POE Ports) - $110
or
Deco X55 (3 gigabit NON-POE Ports) - $90. The 3 ports model has some attraction for me since my system has 1 device (located indoors) that requires a direct Ethernet port connection.
Now for the my next area of ignorance:
How do I inject the POE power into the above plan? Again, (especially since the above is going to cost me more than hoped), I would like to do this for a reasonable price.
Thanks for all your help.
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II do not see any reason to use POE.
POE is an alternative to AC Power for powering an appliance.
POE is used usually when there is no convenient AC power source available for an appliance.
In that case, the appliance can be powered via the Ethernet cable.
Something (usually a POE capable Ethernet switch) needs to inject power in the Ethernet cable, the Deco can be powered via POE, but they do not inject power on the Ethernet cable.
As far as I know, all POE Deco can also be powered from an AC power source.
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